My county will be a "safe space" for all. We will talk to the aggressors, in a calm voice and polietly ask them to dispurse. After offering them mead.

.... there is not deterrent in Pking/PVP, people always find a way. Maybe spawn camping but not regular douchbaggery...

Sounds like you will be happy with Chronicles of Elyria.

It is open world PVP but it is also a crime to kill people (or just knocking them out to steal their stuff).

If someone makes a habit of brazenly attacking Merchants they will end up with a bounty on their head which means people who are skilled at fighting will start hunting them in that area.

This system makes me think both people will enjoy it. The carebare community just has to stick together and if they get targeted ask for help (Through Bounty Contracts or asking the nobility in the area) and the Ganking community gets their fill as well as long as they are okay with the consequences of their actions.

Though PKers could just not focus on one town and attack one area then travel to the next and then continue on which is a viable strategy. Which is cool because traveling bandits/thieves were a very real thing/fear as well.

Unlike games like Ultima online (whos main concept is PvP), this games main concept is life and politics. PvP is just a feature here. Its not about making the game fit for everyone to PK, so the game just isnt. However, going to places that are 'lawless' will still allow those with that itch to go there and try not to get caught.

Other than those... Lawless areas, the only PvP that will exist will be concensual PvP, or PvP at the cost of severe punishment or finally.. basically assassination where the culprit cannot be identified. Obviously Deviants will exist, but those types of characters will avoid PvP at all costs, as they take a more subtle nature.

This is the game we want, not a game where people just go out and kill each other because they can. The balance that exists is basically that PvP is and should be illegal in most areas, but the only real safety is that which is provided for you by others.

Im an old fan and player of Ultimate Online myself back in the 90's when it was a great game. I loved the open PVP, though I did not PVP alot, it gave such realistic concerns and game play knowing that when I go outside of town and in dungeons that I could be PKed, ganked or just die by mobs and looted. I had so much fun and learned alot! UO is where i learned vital tactics that i use in all MMOs and most of the time it actually gives me an advantage. you had to actually think about survival and alliances. UO gave me such great memories... so sad as i watched it slowly decline to crap. So, I am for open PVP but one of the reasons UO changed was because newer players did not like to get pked, they did not like the challenge of surviving and risk, this is a new era of gamer, who is far from the old school gamer who loves risk and challenges. I came to this conclusion over decades of playing MMOs and talking with both old and new gamers. It just seems these kids nowadays want it easy and very to no consequences for their actions, which is not from their real life.

Posted By Darknesse at 1:08 PM - Fri Jan 13 2017

Unlike games like Ultima online (whos main concept is PvP), this games main concept is life and politics. PvP is just a feature here. Its not about making the game fit for everyone to PK, so the game just isnt.

I disagree this game is ment to tell a story about yourself while creating a world. If that story of me is ganking and pvping so be it. Make the game what you want it to be not the other way around. tell your own story :)

In my mind the best thing that CoE has to offer PvP actually comes from the mechanic of land selection and Exposition. People will be investing early into their lands and creating vested interests into seeing those lands protected from players whose only concern is killing others with no regard for consequences. The system is set up so that those protections can be reinforced by the feudal hierarchy and contract system and therefore people looking to establish a secure spot in the world have already begun making ties in existing communities to provide mutual support.

However from a PvPers standpoint, while it may seem that the deck is stacked, there is the Deviant set of skills that enables one to bypass many of the mechanics meant for law enforcement. So what it boils down to is this: is the player killer dedicated and skilled enough to overcome the efforts of the ones in charge of the area they reside in? If the area is ruled by someone unaffiliated, without established support, then the rule of law may be merely lip service. If, on the other hand, the area is part of an established kingdom and community than it may be exceedingly difficult to escape ramifications from the local sheriffs.

Posted By jaspurc at 05:09 AM - Sat Jan 14 2017

Im an old fan and player of Ultimate Online myself back in the 90's when it was a great game. I loved the open PVP, though I did not PVP alot, it gave such realistic concerns and game play knowing that when I go outside of town and in dungeons that I could be PKed, ganked or just die by mobs and looted. I had so much fun and learned alot! UO is where i learned vital tactics that i use in all MMOs and most of the time it actually gives me an advantage. you had to actually think about survival and alliances. UO gave me such great memories... so sad as i watched it slowly decline to crap. So, I am for open PVP but one of the reasons UO changed was because newer players did not like to get pked, they did not like the challenge of surviving and risk, this is a new era of gamer, who is far from the old school gamer who loves risk and challenges. I came to this conclusion over decades of playing MMOs and talking with both old and new gamers. It just seems these kids nowadays want it easy and very to no consequences for their actions, which is not from their real life.

While that may be true, it came with games like WoW where openworld PKing had very little point other than feeling good for harassing someone. I personally dont agree with openworld PvP for the sake of openworld PvP, as you kind of have to take into account that those PKing arnt actually gaining anything, and that puts the balance somewhat towards their favor.

Dont get me wrong, though. I LOVE openworld PvP, there just has to be point to it. I never played UO, but the second you get full loot drops and similar it gets more interesting, because i feel you can punish those players in a much harsher manner and still make the game fun (in relation to risk vs reward). Those same harsh penalties in games without risk just wouldnt belong i feel, because you're only taking time.

In UO, some people killed others because they were jerks and just wanted to gank and loot people weaker than them. I think we might see some of that in Elyria. In UO, I went from Great Lord to Dread Lord in just a day or two mostly for the fun of it, not out of any malice towards anyone. Creating conflict and giving people a "bad guy" to hunt down was fun for me - and I think for them (mostly).

If CoE does well, we'll be seeing hundreds of thousands (hopefully millions!) of people across all servers. Some of those people aren't nice people even in their real lives. It would be difficult to force them to be nice to strangers in a video game. But, if we can band together and make them have a bad day, it'll make for some good story telling. :)

Edit: Oh, and I think with all out wars and plans people have for fighting arenas, people who like to challenge themselves with combat will find outlets without having to resort to picking on innocent farmers.

were jerks and just wanted to gank and loot people weaker than them

At least that involves personal gain. You actually do benefit somewhat from killing and taking those items. It creates something that isnt really personal, since you are actually doing it to gain something from it.

What sort of penalties did UO have for PKing?

IIRC, there were none. Your title changed from blue to red so people could see you were a bad guy and then people would chase and try to kill you on sight pretty much. Also, I think if you walked into a town, the NPC guards would insta-one-shot kill you. :)

Interesting. Though no longer being able to use towns seems like a pretty large drawback.

Carebear and gank... lord how I loathe those terms.

To me MMOs are about interaction with other people. Most of the time those interactions are positive. Trading, crafting or enhancing gear I can't do on my own and dungeon runs.

Othertimes when someone does something stupid for the heck of it or decides they want to camp mob spawn points people need for quests I have simply walked up and murdered them.

At that point it's not so much pvp or the thrill of fighting another player as I'm filling a role the devs failed to ... namely idiot control.

Open world pvp without safe zones means those folks who like to be idiots for the fun of it will very soon find there are almost as many people like me out there as them.

The world will be a far better place for it.

The reason I hate the terms carebear and gank is the connotation they have gained over the years as people joined one camp (pve) or the other (pvp) somehow reinforcing the erroneous conviction people seem to have that the two cannot coexist.

Let's be realistic. A real pvper is someone who is bored with combat mechanics that can be memorized. Which includes almost any instance from modern mmos.

25% health on boss have your fire pots ready as he sets the floor on fire. At 10% it's a DPS race no heals all deeps.

Boring.

A thinking player will usually offer far more challenge and the pvper will typically learn something new.

Such as a healer in Aion simply rooting a Mdps in the abyss and watching his flight time run out and him fall to his death.

COE seems to strike a balance. There is a goal in every encounter with another player. Be it gain territory (war) or gold (deviant). It doesn't mean a person has to be killed or even incapped to accomplish that goal. But still invites clever thinking gameplay.

For those who choose to be idiots and commit mass murder for the sake of it... see first half of this post.

Sorry for being off-topic, but can you stick to paragraphs instead of making a new one for every sentence? It almost puts me off reading it entirely, regardless of the content as its so painful to read.

But thats basically it. Those hitting the little guys will get wrecked in a permanent way by the bigger guys. Carebearing though is a proper term, but its not a negative. It just implies that player does not want to fight, and thats kind of fine.

Posted By Darknesse at 1:50 PM - Fri Jan 13 2017

Sorry for being off-topic, but can you stick to paragraphs instead of making a new one for every sentence? It almost puts me off reading it entirely, regardless of the content as its so painful to read.

But thats basically it. Those hitting the little guys will get wrecked in a permanent way by the bigger guys. Carebearing though is a proper term, but its not a negative. It just implies that player does not want to fight, and thats kind of fine.

If I was on a pc I would. Long rants on a phone are much harder to organize into something that is easy to read.

Other than that if it's hard to read I dunno... skip it?

Being on a phone isnt really relevant xD You can just not hammer the enter key constantly, lol. Thats like... the one formatting thing that phones can still do ok.