Posted By elemage at 6:27 PM - Mon Mar 19 2018

i am a little disappointed in the way this conversation went. while i understand the stigma in most other mmo's i feel that COE is different due to the way it is set up. i personally had high hopes of selling gold to make rent and pay for bills (after all personal in-game costs are covered) instead of working so much so i could spend even more time playing.

You know it goes against the game rules in most, if not all games. It's why Blizzard brought in their own pets/game time people could either buy themselves to sell for gold or buy for gold. So saying you had plans to break the rules on the forums.. yeah.. Not like one person could even make much money anyway, there is a reason those sites have 100s of bots accounts.

Posted By Gunnlang at 02:36 AM - Mon Mar 19 2018

Posted By elemage at 6:27 PM - Mon Mar 19 2018

i am a little disappointed in the way this conversation went. while i understand the stigma in most other mmo's i feel that COE is different due to the way it is set up. i personally had high hopes of selling gold to make rent and pay for bills (after all personal in-game costs are covered) instead of working so much so i could spend even more time playing.

You know it goes against the game rules in most, if not all games. It's why Blizzard brought in their own pets/game time people could either buy themselves to sell for gold or buy for gold. So saying you had plans to break the rules on the forums.. yeah.. Not like one person could even make much money anyway, there is a reason those sites have 100s of bots accounts.

well you see this one doesn't. not yet anyway. and i was not talking about blizzard. also once again COE is not built like other mmo's. due to the design of OPC's and cost of "100's" of bot accounts" it's not viable but, as someone who has and is going to be spending a large investment of my time towards this game it becomes much more viable in a personal regard rather than a mechanized one and not just for me but all the people who are actually going to be pushing this game forward. im not talking about making thousands of dollars over night. im talkng enough to make rent over the course of three to four weeks.

Posted By elemage at 7:08 PM - Mon Mar 19 2018

well you see this one doesn't. not yet anyway. and i was not talking about blizzard. also once again COE is not built like other mmo's. due to the design of OPC's and cost of "100's" of bot accounts" it's not viable but, as someone who has and is going to be spending a large investment of my time towards this game it becomes much more viable in a personal regard rather than a mechanized one and not just for me but all the people who are actually going to be pushing this game forward. im not talking about making thousands of dollars over night. im talkng enough to make rent over the course of three to four weeks.

Wishing a mod was around to point out this will be against the rules, even if it doesn't say it is right now.

Either way, I'm failing to see who would spend RL money to you, when they can just buy it off some NPC/player. I can't see how you would farm so much of whatever that you would have such a supply of it anyway.

At the end, I hope people like you do pop up. Be fat rich targets for me to raid once a week. While knowing people won't stop me since you are bluntly saying you are planning to break the game rules.

lol man im just trying to make a living and play more in game. obviously i won't be doing it if they state it's against the rules but hey until they do i can dream of a life where all i do is immerse myself in a game, but ill see you on the inside, mayor of midlothian.

I sorta get the feeling the OP knows how goldsellers work and what they are capable of. My understanding of the question is will SBS actively discourage/ban the concept of goldsellers or will they let the game take care of itself with little/no interference?

Gold sellers are the worse. I feared this s week. Although I must say reading through this thread I feel a bit better about it. But where there is a will there is a way.

Who is to say they couldn't sell something other than gold in this system either.

I just don't want to see spamming from someone named difottslblblvj nonstop.

Posted By Nino76 at 05:07 AM - Mon Mar 19 2018

Gold sellers are the worse. I feared this s week. Although I must say reading through this thread I feel a bit better about it. But where there is a will there is a way.

Who is to say they couldn't sell something other than gold in this system either.

I just don't want to see spamming from someone named difottslblblvj nonstop.

There are no global or zone channels, so if someone is spamming just walk 50 feet to the right and you'll be out of range.

Posted By gtox at 09:11 AM - Mon Mar 19 2018

Posted By Juris Primus at 3:46 PM - Sun Mar 18 2018

This brings up an extremely valid point. While there is little value to be had for commercial, thieving gold sellers to settle into our world, there may be ample opportunity for local cabals to form that sell resources or services for cash.

If supplier A (owning several iron mines per the above example) were to be in Kingdom W, and W would need iron for a war with Kingdom X, then he better be selling it in game to W for fair exchange. If he does not sell to W, or worse yet sells to X, then King talks to Duke, who talks to Count, until you get to the root of the problem and it is effectively taken care of.

But if A were to offer for cash, to anybody, it should be a gamewide problem, not merely a Kingdom issue. It may be tempting for some unscrupulous players to profit in $$ from current events in the game. One way to deal with it is of course via the above method, or should SbS have a more active role in policing the sale of in game assets for cash?

Even this scenario, imo, is flawed in that - Yes, Supplier A could sell their mine access (for real money) to Kingdom X, but Kingdom X still has to somehow mine those mines.. in their enemy Kingdom's lands, WHILE at war with that Kingdom. The logistical problems here should be a nightmare for everyone involved in the sale.

In the end all you have is a Supplier who received RL money from a very stupid Kingdom that now has access to mines that are nearly impossible for them to make use of and is no closer to winning their war than before the deal, and Kingdom W who, if they win the war, will be seizing all of the Supplier's assets and kicking him out of the Kingdom.

I understand that the previous was just an example of RL money affecting the outcome of wars or other important political events and that some of those events will be logistically and strategically possible, but they will be rare at best. I would also imagine that situations like that would result in a lot of people asking questions, getting answers eventually, and then the ban hammer coming down.

The scenario is to sell the output of the mines, not access to the mines themselves. Like you pointed out, it would be difficult for them to work the mines themselves, but having wagon loads of iron shipped to their crafters would be of immense value. Bonus, is you don't have to tell the buyer where the mines themselves are, so they don't get raided.

Posted By elemage at 7:36 PM - Mon Mar 19 2018

lol man im just trying to make a living and play more in game. obviously i won't be doing it if they state it's against the rules but hey until they do i can dream of a life where all i do is immerse myself in a game, but ill see you on the inside, mayor of midlothian.

Go play second life if you wanna make a killing, while playing the game. Also am I suppose to be scared from some kind of threat? I just think of another free citizen I got, even if you really wanna kill me. Be an interesting storyline at least. :)

I think the part that bothers me the most seems to be missed here. The issue is not will Gold Farmers be GOOD at farming GOLD, but rather how much DAMAGE will they do to the GAME as a whole.

If they go in and F* up an area royally, then the players have to deal with it. I've played games with gold farmers and limited supplies. Look at LiF. There are groups from certain areas, that shall not be named to avoid any community rule infringement, that go into an area and STRIP all the resources out that they can. They don't care about response. It's hard to defend your land when a zerg rush of somehting like 2-300 bots come in and devastate an area(without your permission) in a day or two. They move like locusts across the map and leave devastated barren wastelands in their wake. Well, they try to do so at least. Often times they just do a decent bit of damage before people band together and push them out.

The DAMAGE however, is the part that concerns me, not the selling of gold. If they go in and fubar the area without permission and leave..the players still have to deal with the fall out. If they roam through and kill all the wildlife, then all of a sudden there is no wildlife. THAT is an issue. They may not be able to farm legit gold(as in the metal/currency), but they can easily farm things that would cause enough of an issue for it to have a detrimental impact on people who actually play the game.

I am hoping SBS takes this into consideration in the mechanics. I would be very annoyed if 6 months into the game no wildlife can be found in whole areas and significant damage to vital resources other than wildlife has been done.

In LiF, which I know is a different game but has "finite resources" You would be amazed at how much damage can be done when you have a zerg army to do it. Moving large amounts of inventory is easy when you have large amounts of people to do it,

Example 1: Wildlife is NOT permanently spawnable. They've said if you kill all the critters, the critters be dead. If the farmers come in and clear our whole areas of wildlife(which doesn't even require land you own to hunt, if you do so illegally), then whole areas lack wildlife. Then they strip the corpses of whatever they think is the best to sell and run it back to their base. Honestly, the map isn't THAT big, and I know in LiF the botters/gold farmers will literally auto-run for HOURS to get from point A to point B if they're trying to push into an area. This is not something in LiF because the animals respawn every day or so in-game(8hours real time).

Example 2: Mining may not actually require owning the land. From what I understand, it only requires owning the land if you BUILD on it, and even then maybe only if you build large enough. Gold farmers move into a mountain range and prospect around and strip out ore; having bots run the raw ore back to a base to be smelted and sold. If you have 50 bots with 10 miners and 40 runners, you can move a large amount of ore out of an area relatively quickly. This DOES happen in LiF with both ores as well as clay and other non-renewable materials regularly.

Example 3: Wild resources that take time to grow/harvest/cultivate and are technically renewable. Trees take time to grow, gold farmers don't care about renewable practices, In LiF they will literally go into an area with basic tools(primitive stone) and clear cut whole server segments. They may or may not be able to impact things on parceled land, but if it's in the wild, they would likely do what they do in LiF. While you can "recover" the area by replanting and such, it still kills any easy access and takes a long time to fix. My server had this issue a few months ago and it literally stalled the kingdom for about a month. No idea how the mechanics here will work in CoE, but the gold farmers literally cut down every tree they could on an entire area and just left the logs to rot and despawn. Not only did this cause a lot of lag, but it made building ANYTHING a nightmare until the damage could be fixed.

These are the kinds of things I am thinking they are liable to do. The latter is an inconvenience, but the first two could have long-term consequences for players.