COMMUNITY - FORUMS - GENERAL DISCUSSION
Why I can't support this game.

So I love the idea of this game, I would love to buy the high end 245 dollar pack to help push it forward. Here is the issue. You are already trying to put mounts, items, as well as things for decoration such as styles for your coat of arms etc behind pay walls. I can't in good faith support a game like this. I would rather pay 30 dollars a month for a game that has everything in it from the start and is fantastic than a game that even before launch has already pay-walled a good chunk of its game. I am sorry but I will not see you in Elyria unless this is changed.


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2/18/2019 7:16:10 AM #1

I'm sorry to hear that you feel that way, however all I can say is:

Welcome to a Crowdfunded Game

They require to sell things in order to keep the game funded and in order to be able to promote the game further so that development on it can remain operational and we eventually are able to see a finished product.

It has been stated various multiple times that things like mounts, and skins and cash shop items of the like will NOT be in after launch.

So with this in mind, I hope that it helps to set you at ease a bit.

If you have any questions please feel free to let us know so that we may help you as best as possible.


2/18/2019 7:43:25 AM #2

Keep checking in until after launch, Eric. Then, if it looks good to you, you can get a basic package and jeer at all of us who bought copious pre-launch goodies while you loot our bodies and squat on our property. That's kind of what a good many of us expect to happen.


2/18/2019 8:26:44 AM #3

Even if all those things are available in the store now, that does not mean that they are hidden behind a paywall. Once launch, the store will go down (besides for sparks of life and souls) and you can get all those things ingame for ingame effort.


Friend Code: 30EF47

2/18/2019 8:54:48 AM #4

That's like entering an ice cream parlor where people are eating ice cream and announcing to everyone that you like the ice cream but that you won't buy it.

For the sake of an actual conversation and an attempt to understand your motivation and where you're coming from with this: What do you expect to happen here?

Do you want the devs to adjust their project, backed by thousands of other people, according to your personal taste, wealth and feelings? If not, why make the post?


2/18/2019 10:05:11 AM #5

Posted By Eric The Dangerous at

So I love the idea of this game, I would love to buy the high end 245 dollar pack to help push it forward. Here is the issue. You are already trying to put mounts, items, as well as things for decoration such as styles for your coat of arms etc behind pay walls. I can't in good faith support a game like this. I would rather pay 30 dollars a month for a game that has everything in it from the start and is fantastic than a game that even before launch has already pay-walled a good chunk of its game. I am sorry but I will not see you in Elyria unless this is changed.

What if I told you, that the $240 package comes with

....wait for it !!!!!!!!!

Adventurer's Pack: A backpack A collection of trail rations Random treasure maps in your home region Founder's Pack A detailed map of your home county Merchant's Pack A set of merchant scales A detailed map of your home duchy A map of a historical, possibly unexplored location Pack Mule A pack mule to ride and haul your gear

Pet: Choose 1 of 5 in-game pets to call your own

Horse & Saddlebags A Horse and saddlebags

Purebred Horse A purebread horse for breeding or travelling

Wagon A Wagon

Ursaphant An Ursaphant mount

Surname Choose your own custom surname (can include your whole family)

Custom Coat of Arms Heraldry - Create a custom Coat of Arms for your surname and kingdom

Expanded Colors Gain access to expanded colors for your Custom Coat of Arms

Expanded Sigils Gain access to expanded sigils for your Custom Coat of Arms

Decorative Plaque A decorative plaque with your family's coat of arms

Homesteader Artwork A decorative artwork for your home to commemorate your role as a homesteader

and more !!!!

ReAdInG HaRd.


If ethics are poor at the top, that behavior is copied down through the organization. -Robert Noyce

2/18/2019 12:12:06 PM #6

Please understand that the merchandise shop, outside of event promotions, consist mostly of just a la carte items, meant to supplement the pledge packages and will be phased out along with them ('a la carte' means being able to buy items found in packages separately). In other words, as hinted at by Lord_Greystoke, if you get the $245 pledge package you get basically almost everything persistent currently on the store.

The only exception to this is the Otterbears, which was added to the shop because of the May 2018 kickstarter anniversary milestone, though it's expected they too will get phased out along with the other mounts/pets in the end.

Beyond that the limited time promotional items which pops up now and then as part of various lore building events is partly in order to help seed the initial world as well as help them maintain development without an investor/publisher for as long possible - at least until they find one who can agree to not having an item shop post-launch.

You see, CoE doesn't work well with item shops and loot boxes after launch as it's simulating a closed economy and their arguments against such microtransactions post-launch is relatively frequently stated, even in developer interviews as far back as 2015. That doesn't mean the game couldn't be monetized otherwise, but they have expressed a desire to keep the game primarily running on the sparks (which is essentially a cheap annual subscription model).

Take note that everything can be stolen, shared, or sold. Animals can be breed. Items can be copied (replication skills). In other words, if you get to know someone who have an item you like you can most likely work out a way with that person to get access to a blueprint or a copy of that item after launch. The only exception to this is the kickstarter-exclusive Phoenix pet which is a bit tricky to breed since the parents have a high risk of perishing from the mating process depending on the breeders skills in animal care.

2/18/2019 3:17:57 PM #7

Posted By Eric The Dangerous at

So I love the idea of this game, I would love to buy the high end 245 dollar pack to help push it forward. Here is the issue. You are already trying to put mounts, items, as well as things for decoration such as styles for your coat of arms etc behind pay walls. I can't in good faith support a game like this. I would rather pay 30 dollars a month for a game that has everything in it from the start and is fantastic than a game that even before launch has already pay-walled a good chunk of its game. I am sorry but I will not see you in Elyria unless this is changed.

games and their development need to be funded

it used to take big title companies many years and many millions of dollars to (hopefully) recoup their expenses and turn a profit, and this was done almost always through monthly subscriptions

as somebody who has paid subscriptions for games since 1998 (Ultima Online) i know that for me personally, the games i stuck around in the longest are subscription games - they had a level playing field, were higher quality, more content, tended to keep out a large number of the trolls, delivered new expansions etc

the reality is that is all changing, and has been for some time

back then you typically chose one, possibly two mmo's that you liked and spent your $15/mo subscription on them and played them for years

today's gaming community is far less 'loyal' to a game, and there is a way way larger number of online games to choose from, and the 'attention span' given to a game is usually far shorter

though there were other factors involved as well, even Elder Scrolls Online had to do away with its monthly subscription less than 2 years after launching

so what are the options? - the obvious one is loot boxes and/or pay-to-win items that can only be achieved through the cash shop and are typically bound to character/account

SBS has stated that they won't go down that road, though for me personally the soul packs definitely cross into the grey area of loot boxes (a discussion that has already been hashed out in other threads)

instead they have come up with (to me) a rather interesting and ingenious financial model of where you pay for your soul - based upon your playstyle it will last between 4-10 months and with a cost of $35.00 I basically view it as a variable subscription of between $4.00 to $8.00 a month

i think that's probably the closest you're going to get to a subscription model for a new mmo these days

in the meantime the development is being crowd funded through promotions that will give you items that you will be able to get in game anyhows, and that are subject to being lost, dying, stolen etc

my personal opinion is that you are unlikely to see a new good quality mmo hit the market that has a monthly subscription as its only financial source of income


2/18/2019 4:19:20 PM #8

Posted By Dleatherus at 10:17 AM - Mon Feb 18 2019

Posted By Eric The Dangerous at

So I love the idea of this game, I would love to buy the high end 245 dollar pack to help push it forward. Here is the issue. You are already trying to put mounts, items, as well as things for decoration such as styles for your coat of arms etc behind pay walls. I can't in good faith support a game like this. I would rather pay 30 dollars a month for a game that has everything in it from the start and is fantastic than a game that even before launch has already pay-walled a good chunk of its game. I am sorry but I will not see you in Elyria unless this is changed.

games and their development need to be funded

it used to take big title companies many years and many millions of dollars to (hopefully) recoup their expenses and turn a profit, and this was done almost always through monthly subscriptions

as somebody who has paid subscriptions for games since 1998 (Ultima Online) i know that for me personally, the games i stuck around in the longest are subscription games - they had a level playing field, were higher quality, more content, tended to keep out a large number of the trolls, delivered new expansions etc

the reality is that is all changing, and has been for some time

back then you typically chose one, possibly two mmo's that you liked and spent your $15/mo subscription on them and played them for years

today's gaming community is far less 'loyal' to a game, and there is a way way larger number of online games to choose from, and the 'attention span' given to a game is usually far shorter

though there were other factors involved as well, even Elder Scrolls Online had to do away with its monthly subscription less than 2 years after launching

so what are the options? - the obvious one is loot boxes and/or pay-to-win items that can only be achieved through the cash shop and are typically bound to character/account

SBS has stated that they won't go down that road, though for me personally the soul packs definitely cross into the grey area of loot boxes (a discussion that has already been hashed out in other threads)

instead they have come up with (to me) a rather interesting and ingenuous financial model of where you pay for your soul - based upon your playstyle it will last between 4-10 months and with a cost of $35.00 I basically view it as a variable subscription of between $4.00 to $8.00 a month

i think that's probably the closest you're going to get to a subscription model for a new mmo these days

in the meantime the development is being crowd funded through promotions that will give you items that you will be able to get in game anyhows, and that are subject to being lost, dying, stolen etc

my personal opinion is that you are unlikely to see a new good quality mmo hit the market that has a monthly subscription as its only financial source of income

I would go a step further and say its illogical for a company to totally eschew other additional revenue models if a significant portion of the player base support having them.

I actually feel it is a mistake on Soulbound's part to not sell some of these items post launch, but its their game, so their rules after all.


You must all be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to get angry. JAMES 1:19 NLT

2/18/2019 4:36:51 PM #9

Its a careful balance.

Too modest with introducing new revenue sources, and the game may die from lack of funding.

Too much, and they start to look like greedy pay wall sell-outs.

I don't envy them, or fault them, for trying to strike that balance and produce this game.

2/19/2019 1:33:42 AM #10

Others have mentioned why CoE has nothing to do with pay wall.

Let me get this straight, without the merchandise store at the moment. This game cannot be made. Period.

No matter how you look at it, no investors / publishers are willing to invest in such a project (up till this point in time). If you have another method that allow SBS to raise another $ 5 mil. Please propose here. I am sure everyone will be interested.

If we cannot accept the store, we would be stuck dreaming for a dynamic gaming world for another "who knows how many years".

If the project is completed, fulfilling its vision. Please thank those people who were willing to take that risk, and back the project with real $. That's why a game like this can be even attempted.


Never argue with an idiot, cuz he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Vice mayor of Lux Verloren

2/19/2019 1:35:29 AM #11

Posted By TR3LON1ST at 4:54 PM - Mon Feb 18 2019

That's like entering an ice cream parlor where people are eating ice cream and announcing to everyone that you like the ice cream but that you won't buy it.

For the sake of an actual conversation and an attempt to understand your motivation and where you're coming from with this: What do you expect to happen here?

Do you want the devs to adjust their project, backed by thousands of other people, according to your personal taste, wealth and feelings? If not, why make the post?

Though I agree with your metaphor, it is still good to have others to come in once a while, telling us how CoE is perceived outside our circle. : )

More people joining is still a good thing.


Never argue with an idiot, cuz he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Vice mayor of Lux Verloren

2/19/2019 2:47:36 AM #12

I've read many of the posts here and I would like to clarify. I made this post to draw attention to the buy now play later idea. I am fine funding a game that deserves the funding but lately in the gaming world there are a lot of pay wall items that DO effect the game. If I have to pay money to have an item that does something special that effects actual game play that is in itself insane. I understand the people here who support the game and may be upset at my post, thats the risk you take of making one like this here. I read about the adventurer's pack as well as all the others. I am not interested in having gameplay mechanics, items, etc being held at ransom. If you have these items developed by launch and you refuse to let players earn them in game without forking over money that is unacceptable. Gamers have to stop letting companies (crowdfunded or not) hold us hostage for the rest of the game. Mortal Kombat famously did this with their day 1 dlc characters. They had them already made and in the game but put them behind a paywall. I understand funding a game isn't easy. I understand getting donations is hard, but at the end of the day games like this keep themselves from ever taking off (if they release at all) because when they do this turns off most potential players. The people donating are going to play no matter what. The issue is sustaining your finances for the ones after it launches. I want to see a game like this successful, but not like this.


2/19/2019 2:55:30 AM #13

Hey Eric, just to add my 2 cents :D

There is nothing that you can get prior to launch that you cannot get post launch. And most all of the items are standard items anyway, with very few high quality items that can still be lost or stolen.

Even the monarchs that backed the game for 10k dollars, it has been explicitly said multiple times that all title holders are expected to lose their titles at some point in game to other players. (granted it's not a guarantee, just the expectation)

I kinda view everything purchased prior to launch as another item to tie you down into one spot lose later on. EP spent on expo doesn't really get you "ahead" it just builds the world and makes it more interesting for other players, but the ones that can really experience the game with nothing tying them down will be people that back at the adventurer level.

I can see why some people don't want to back the game at this time, I would just keep an open mind so later on down the road when your fears are assuaged you will consider coming back.


2/19/2019 3:06:13 AM #14

Posted By Eric The Dangerous at 7:47 PM - Mon Feb 18 2019

>If you have these items developed by launch and you refuse to let players earn them in game without forking over money that is unacceptable.

From what I recall other than a very few number of things (the phoenix pet and maybe a beehive?) that have been on offer pre-game, EVERYTHING you can get through the pay store or special events can be earned or made in game, purely through game mechanics and not through paying real world money (beyond the initial investment of a Spark to start playing). The adventurer pack I get as part of my package also comes with a recipe so that if it is destroyed or lost while playing, I can make more.

If this is truly the part that has you concerned, then there is no need for concern, because the devs are not "holding items hostage" that you can't get once the game starts. Such an idea runs very counter to their ideals about how the game should be played.


Death is just another path, one we all must take

Friend Code: C8DF9C

2/19/2019 3:13:15 AM #15

Posted By Eric The Dangerous at 6:47 PM - Mon Feb 18 2019

... If you have these items developed by launch and you refuse to let players earn them in game without forking over money that is unacceptable. ...

Would you believe that a lot of us agree with you on this? Especially anything that affects the success of gameplay.

Titles and coats of arms and such that don't correspond to in-game power, wealth, or earned renown will become empty trappings suitable only for some varieties of role-play or historical color. Property like animals and structures will either die or decay naturally without maintenance. Within a year of gameplay (RL), everything that was purchased by backers will become moot, except for bragging rights, unless the players are better at playing the game than the players who didn't have, or didn't choose to spend, their money up front.

Kudos for expressing your opinion, Eric. If you are interested enough, however, please research the game's systems as originally defined and as they evolve.


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