Thanks for this post. I've more or less been asking around for something like this for a while now, and appreciate the thought and insight you've put in. :)

In your opinion, for a double count, what is the absolute most amount of EP you'd recommend before one reaches ridiculous/pointless (having to buy things like legendary toilet seats, etc) EP levels?

well sadly i am not the best example for that question as when i was a double county i was already at 16k ep.... (i also have 2 mayors over 8k ep...)

what can i say i have a very very specialised plan for my county being a bread basket for my duchy and in the future my kingdom...

that asside i would say 10k+ ep per county and your starting go a little over the top.

that being said you would have one of the better developed counties in the game

I really appreciate posts like this! Makes me feel a lot better about my EP levels lol

Most of those are too high, The packs come with enough to outfit what ever your domain is well enough.

I dont think they are too high. I think they help account for peoples inflated expectations that may have to be made up for.

Posted By Gunghoe at 4:14 PM - Sun May 20 2018

Most of those are too high, The packs come with enough to outfit what ever your domain is well enough.

that all depends on your view of "well enough"

no one denies that the base levels of ep that are available per account are what sbs has claimed would be all we realy need. but to be brutal honest SBS has under estimated us time and time again.

remember they never expected us to form kingdoms before domain selection. so they actualy hiting the mark of what a count would truly need is suspect at best.

plus why have a EP store if every thing we need is covered... that to me points to the fact that it is not and that if you want to improve from the most basic rustic of starts you should look to invest a little more.

i know there are sections of the community that will rebel against the idea of putting more money into COE then they already have and others who will scream P2W but the majority understand that it is Pay to Build.

but one thing also to think on is that by also investing more you increase the chances that the game will come out the way we wish at lunch with less interference from developers want cash shops and loot boxs.

so for me it is all a win win and win.

but of-cause every one is entitled to there views :)

Posted By Gunghoe at 4:14 PM - Sun May 20 2018

Most of those are too high, The packs come with enough to outfit what ever your domain is well enough.

Packs come with enough to fill out the basic level of whatever the title someone has. If say a count for example wants better roads, they should probably buy more EP for that. Most of that seems to be if you wanna go above the basic level anyway. Want to give whatever area you are looking over a personal touch. Personally I would love to start with most of the important crafting stations within my town. Start the game running basically.

If Bloodline comes with 100EP I don't necessarily know that you'd need over 1000 to be successful. That would stand to reason that most gentry are being expected to fail and I simply don't think SbS would do something like that.

Keep in mind 1250EP is $100 more added onto an only $120 ($135 now) package. So needing to shell out virtually the same amount for EP as you did for your package seems to me like it's probably not too close to reality.

That said, people can read this thread to get an idea of some things they might be able to buy with EP.

Posted By mandrake1980 at

(...)Gentry(...) 1 x Land use kit 175 ep 1 x storefront kit 125 ep 1 x wagon 100 ep

That makes me wonder, since SBS usually tries to highlight the fact that unlike in most other games you are unlikely to be jack of all trades and instead 'focus on just one thing', do you really think we'd have the time to be 'craftsman', sell our own goods in the shop and travel for resources at the same time? Wouldn't it make more sense that we'd each focus on what we do and have specialist merchants taking the trip delivering goods? Or in other terms, I'm not sure the wagon is of much use, but instead you might want to get a higher quality starting kit for your trade.

Posted By Tiffany at 03:18 AM - Sun May 20 2018

If Bloodline comes with 100EP I don't necessarily know that you'd need over 1000 to be successful. That would stand to reason that most gentry are being expected to fail and I simply don't think SbS would do something like that.

Keep in mind 1250EP is $100 more added onto an only $120 ($135 now) package. So needing to shell out virtually the same amount for EP as you did for your package seems to me like it's probably not too close to reality.

That said, people can read this thread to get an idea of some things they might be able to buy with EP.

I agree, also its important to realise that theres a chance all this extra ep will go to waste if your land itself isint that profitable to begin with. its not like we will all be sitting on these vast pools of resources allowing us to do virtually anything we wish.

Thank you for the work mandrake1980, this kind of work can help those that need help decide what level of EP they need.

Are mandrake estimates too high, or too low ? remember "Please be mindful these are suggested limits and are of my own opinion." Those numbers are his opinion and he explains how he builds them.

Do we need EP ? NO, no one needs any EP even those that gets packages that grant EP do not need to buy anything with it. EP is to build the world, to customize your package, nothing that you can buy with EP is necessary, nor will it be necessarily yours.

Remember that for the huge majority of people and without doubt for most gentry, people will start in a family, a family with a house, an occupation and probably some wealth and possession. Do i need a profession kit to be a smith ? if you select a smith family chances are you wont need it, so maybe the storefront kit ? same if you selected a smith family chances that your family already has a forge are great and i am not sure your family will be happy with you opening an other one in the same settlement to be concurrent to theirs and same can be said for land-use kit. Same things goes for mayor and above our settlements and domain do not need any of those things to run.

So why the hell would i want to buy any of those then ? It all depends on the situation, your plans and your community. There is no such thing as too much EP but there is bad EP. BAD EP is EP spend without taking land, domain and population into account.

As i said earlier, opening a concurrent shop to your family business in the same settlement is BAD EP, opening one in the next settlement where none exist is good EP, but instead of a forge you can spend EP to open a warehouse or a showroom to develop your family business, that is good EP. Adding land for fields to your family farm might be bad EP if there is not enough mannpower there, building a house or cottage for the extra hired hep is good EP ......

Same goes with every thing, developing what already exist if the existing can support the growth is good, developing extra options when that do not conflict existing ones is good EP. But all the things we build will need manning and upkeep, they will use resources that might be more needed elsewhere.

CoE looks a lot like our real world, if your dream is to be a fisher but there is no room for an extra one in your home village you'll have to make a life choice, either you switch to an other occupation or you move to settle in an other place. If you keep on and spend the EP to be that not needed extra fisher in your home village you'll only end up damaging it.

So when dealing with EP be smart and patient, wait to know what you need and where rather than just drop thing into the world.

yes with gentry some would need a wagon some would not but thats where your own goals come into play.

in the case of a smith they may need to pick up ore or send one of the journeymen to do it. hell you could be in a hamlet for all i know. but i am highly doubtful that the iron mine will do delvery directly to the smith but you would expect them to send it to a market place and again i dont see the market place transporting the iron to your smithy unless you have a contract in place a wagon may be needed

still it was not designed to be a 1 size fits all but more a general idea for people to think on.

hell you could decide to be a bee keeper and not needed but yet again this about you thinking about your goal, i only place up suggested minmun dose this mean you must have this? hell no.

but i will say 100 ep will not give you alot of choice and as markof mentions there may be family business in place but i must stress there is no guarantee you gain this. casp has constantly stressed you would need to build up your reputation with your own family in order to get them to put you in the will. inheritance is not guaranteed

so if you dont cosy up ur stuck with 100 ep which could get you a plot of land as base price for 1 plot is 100 ep but not alot else.

but with 1k ep you could buy 5 wagons, mounts then hire some drivers, buy a plot of land setup a warehouse/workshop and start a transport company. u would not be a huge company but you would have the makings of a successful one.

yet again it all comes down to what you want to do.

i just thought i would help clear that up because as i said no 1 size fits all but i feel my post gives a nice framework to work from.

any way hope you enjoy the read if nothing else :)

That's a lot of wagons. Keep in mind we are joining an existing world, even during Exposition. So trade will already be going between settlements. You may need to shift the focus of the trade depending on what you want your town/county/duchy/kingdom to become, but the wagons for the npc traders will be there. So you don't want to have more wagons than you have PC traders in your town. Plus, if the count wants my taxes, he better sends someone himself to collect them.

Overall a nice list though, it matches quite well what I had in mind myself. I will probably be looking for quality over quantity though. It will be better to have a few high quality things, rather than a lot of common stuff.

I have a total of 2100 EP as a mayor. Hopefully should be enough. It's possible I may get more but not probable.

Very interesting and helpful post Mandrake. Thank you very much. This post is a good example of why I am likely to be a part of your county. You and I thinkin similar ways.

In the spirit of helping others I will give a rough outline of one plan I am working on. I have more than one plan depending on what I start with in Exposition. Hopefully this will be useful for someone.

Plan: Large Farm (from scratch)

Land x9 parcels = 900-1800 (hopefully uncommon quality)

Common Fence x46 = 460

Uncommon Fence x24 = 480

Rare Fence x20 = 1000

Stone House x1 = 750

Stone Cottage x3 = 975

Wood Shack x4 = 400

Wood Barn x4 = ??? Unknown options

Small Shop x2 = ??? Will depend on community needs and existing family

Carts x4 = 300

Mules x3 = ??? 300

Tools x10 = 100

Containers x16 = 400+

Trough x4 = ??? Unknown cost and number needed

Livestock x4 (+) = 200+

Fruit Trees x4 (+) = 600+

Crops x4 (+) = 400+

Various Resources x10 = 100

Contracts x4 = 100

Weapons x10 = 750 practice dummy cost not known.

Well x1 = ??? Unknown cost and need for a farm this size.

Total Cost = >8700 EP

Everything I have put above is based on being spawned into a situation where a new farm this size is both needed and possible. The number of variables that could impact the details is endless so the foundation of all of it is flexibility and the assumption that the plan will change. I have plans based on different numbers of parcels, quality of land, size of community, and biome. I also can’t forget to think about what my Duke, Count, and Mayor will be planning and putting in place. If I am working with Mandrake I will be looking at how I can fit into his plans.

The Large Farm plan I have laid out is the size of a Self-sustaining Hamlet. It is not a typical family farm and it is not meant to be. This is the largest and most complex plan I have created. It is meant to be a challenge. It is not going to be simple to create, run, or maintain.

Available EP = 4500. This may change by the time we get to Exposition. Package = Settler. Additional items have also been bought already.