I think this was partially addressed in a Q&A..For allies. I'm not sure how it works but it was said you can drag people a short way..Like in your example if someone is in the middle of the road you should be able to drag them to the side of the road. It was also said you can tie people out but it would drop off after awhile. Would be neat if allies could give someone permission for full carry or had to accept it.

ya i was thinking that if one of your allies could not walk. for example they got a arrow in the knee (hehehe) then they would have to limp incredibly slowly however if they had a friend then perhaps there could be some prompt that appears for that friend when they are nearby in which case after the prompt is used it gives the inured player a prompt in which they chose to allow the player to carry them.

but overall it has to be dynamic. carrying someone in light cloths who does not weigh much and carries nothing with them should be far easier to carry around in terms of speed and endurance loss than carrying someone who is fat and is in heavy plate armor carrying a backpack full of bricks and a battleaxe strapped to his hand.

Binding someone has no effect unless you have a bounty on them.

If you are not walking the player back towards the sherif's office or wherever justice is to be served, then that player will break the bindings (automatically) so you cannot grief them by walking them off a cliff / onto a boat and out to sea etc.

Dragging bodies is extremely limited, I don't think it'll differentiate between allies and non-allies for dragging.

Im skeptical of any "carry" or "capture" mechanism as there are a thousand and one ways to exploit a mechanic like that and use it for griefing.

There's a good reason why you don't see any games that involve players being responsible for hauling players into prisons; they're always teleported into a prison, if a prison mechanic existed at all. There's also a good reason you don't see many games with successful prison systems...

Any time you take control out of the hands of the player, you quickly come up to the threshold of "why am i paying for a game where i don't have control over my character."

Just look at ARK. 2-3 players can keep several other players incap'd and unable to do anything in it via forced drugging for hours or days if they wanted with rotating duties.

Here's a good example of how quickly things get complicated:

-What defines a sheriffs office? Do all towns get one? If someone puts a bounty token but they're from a poor village with no sherrif, where do you carry them to?

-What if you have to walk around a curved path to get back to the sherrifs office and inadvertently have to walk "away" from the sherrif? How far "away" are you allowed to walk?

-What happens if you pick someone up and just stand still? How long can you hold someone and just grief them by not moving?

-Whats to stop someone from knocking someone out, picking them up, waiting for them to "awaken" or "free themselves", knock them out again, and then pick them up again, and just grief them indefinitely?

These are just the questions i thought of off the top of my head. Imagine how many other questions have to be solved that we haven't thought of yet.

Here's a good example of how quickly things get complicated:

-What defines a sheriffs office? Do all towns get one? If someone puts a bounty token but they're from a poor village with no sherrif, where do you carry them to?

response That we don't know... just it's the place to return the player to. I imagine from a poor village with no sheriff you'll go to the nearest town and report the crime. Crimes are kingdom based so I believe there will be plenty available.

-What if you have to walk around a curved path to get back to the sherrifs office and inadvertently have to walk "away" from the sherrif? How far "away" are you allowed to walk?

response again - don't know. We know the general design but not specific game mechanics. We'll have to await alpha and see how that plays out.

-What happens if you pick someone up and just stand still? How long can you hold someone and just grief them by not moving?

response I cannot actively recall, but you need to be progressing back. I'm sure that if you go slowly and/or just stand around for 30 minutes then there's a chance they'll break free (again an automatic function)

-Whats to stop someone from knocking someone out, picking them up, waiting for them to "awaken" or "free themselves", knock them out again, and then pick them up again, and just grief them indefinitely?

response Absolutely nothing. But then I am sure there will be other systems around how the bounty system works. As for binding someone without a bounty, basically it's cosmetic only because when they awaken... the bonds won't hold.

These are just the questions i thought of off the top of my head. Imagine how many other questions have to be solved that we haven't thought of yet.

response I've seen heaps of questions like this on here and IRC. For the most part, specific examples as you've used are just theory-crafting mechanics until we get to alpha. Once we have alpha we'll have more definition, for now we can only relay the general designed plan of how things will work.

I understand we don't know a lot of this yet; those questions were mostly rhetorical. None of us could possibly answer this besides Caspian, but he very well may not have had time to address the mechanic yet.

That's my point. Its a staggeringly complex mechanic with a large number of variables that have to be accounted for.

What is this worth to us, or to the game? How much time and money should go into this mechanic? Much like CoE-Voip, i think this is better left off the table entirely.

It would be far simpler to, say, let bounty tokens be a free-reign open season on the criminal with additional spirit loss upon CDG of the criminal.

I like the idea of additional ways to support friends and allies like carrying them to safety(like in ARMA). But I definitely understand that it can be somewhat exploited to cause griefing.

So why not add some level of agency for players in both scenarios? If the carried person has some ability to escape being carried, and the act of carrying causes some endurance loss/fatigue, then I think it could still be a viable mechanic.

In the first scenario(friends carrying to safety), the character being carried would just let it happen. In the second scenario, the carried character could struggle multiple times or wait for a better opportunity to escape. Obviously multiple "slavers" could make it almost impossible to escape, but there's no real away around that if you want this kind of mechanic.

There's probably better ways to handle this kind of mechanic, but that was just the one I thought of on the top of my head.

a big griefing problem i have come across is the constant knocking out of someone which i dont think has been addressed to my knowledge. for a example you could in theory knock someone out..wait for them to wake up and knock them out again.

a easy fix for this would of course be a 1 knock out rule per day. meaning if you are knocked out by another player when you wake up again if you are knocked out by another player you insta die. this stops constant griefing and fix's alot of the issues that could happen if you can pick up someone that is unconscious. as you can no longer knock out, pick up, knock out, then pick up again. its 1 knock out then if you have the endurance pick them up and carry them around for 3 min per real life day and that's IT per person. if you expect to get any farther you get them to move of their own volition which you can do in certain situations.

for a example lets say you knock someone out, bind their hands, pick them up and start moving. 3 minutes later were you probably have taken them someplace where they cant call for help or even know where they are you give them a choice. come with you and they wont die, don't or try and excape and they die. they will have a choice to either try and run and risk being killed as they will not be knocked out and instead insta killed if their hp drops to zero again. or they listen to you and do what you say

this could also be used for justice systems as well. for example if your a bounty hunter and you have the bounty token for someone. after you knock them out and drag them a good distance and put some nice hand cuffs on them you can then present the bounty to them and give them the choice to die and take the spirit loss of not only their death but for all the crimes that the bounty has them listed for or they could walk back with the bounty hunter to stand trial and perhaps be proven innocent or reduce their punishment. ideally this message showing the bounty and the crimes and punishment should be shown to the person the bounty was written for when the bounty hunter knocks them out. letting them know they have been caught.

THIS makes it far more interesting as it gives players the choice to either die attempting to escape or stick with their captors until their ambitions are fulfilled be it bringing in the bounty or ransoming a king that does not want a massive spirit loss due to the fame system. it also means you dont need any weird unique mechanic for the justice system to work and gives players of many different play-styles to use it as a tool be it bounty hunters or kidnappers

the only issues then are that of water and throwing someone in to the ocean.

ideally if you are thrown in to the ocean unconscious then you wake up with full endurance anything binding you is removed and you can basically try and swim to the shore.

IF THEY THEN TRY AND KILL YOU IN THE WATER: i would say that if you are killed while in the water near a shore (1-3 minutes from the shore) then you should re-spawn there. notice i say "KILLED" and not "DROWNED" which is a big difference. drowning is where you fall unconscious from exhaustion and then fall beneath the water and "drown". but if you are killed aka knocked out AGAIN because of another player and not you exhausting yourself. for a example if you are knocked out on land, put on a boat, taken out to sea, then thrown overboard, and then as your trying to swim your way to land they put a arrow in your back which would normally knock you out but because you have already been knocked out you instead instantly die resulting in death by arrow and not drowning. WHAT THIS MEANS. is that you simply respawn somewhere on shore away from the people that killed you after performing a spirit walk. BUT if you cannot make it back to shore before your endurance runs out then you lose conciseness and drown resulting in perma death. opc's could potentially just swim to the closest shore if there is one nearby.

notice in this situation it is "near shore" and not "in the middle of the ocean". in which case if you are killed out there expect to die. pirates are gonna be hated far more than they where in the colonial days xD

although just to be safe i suggest staying away from big bodies of water near creepy people.

I guess I misheard then. I thought it was said you could bind people period the binds don't stay on them though unless they have a bounty. So, if I fought some random guy in the woods I could knock him out. Bind him and leave. After a minute or so the binds would come off.

ideally yes. but after they wake up they could jump off unless you made it very clear to them its not in their best interest.

I believe this comes into the same basket of dragging them. Couldn't move them ONTO an object in order to cart their unconscious body away. The exception being if they were being bound as part of a bounty token to drag away.