Don't mind me. Random citizen of Angelica here to take notes on Selene's plans. Purely for academic reasons...

Purely Academic indeed

Some more information on the mentioned maps:

E is the only map of the 20 available that has a duchy on its own isle (northern brudvir). All kingdoms here border 2-3 other kingdoms and not just 1-2 like on C. It has a thin middle (like most others and B/C) and a HUGE kypiq-biome, so lots of wood for ships^^

G is stacked atop, such that all kingdoms only have 1-2 borders to other kingdoms (minimum possible bordernumber). It has a big bay with a thin way to the open sea, much like the Mediterranean Sea, which might keep ships kinda safe from storms. It has the smallest possible kypiq-biome.

J does NOT have a thin middle and one kingdom borders FOUR other kingdoms, which is (shared with 3 other maps) the highest number across all maps and all others have minimum 2 neigbours. If said kingdom is good in diplomacy, this map could be awesome for trading and travelling. Kypiq are huge again.

M has no thin chokepoint, kingdomborders go from 1 to 3. it looks kinda average with small kingdoms 1 and 2, which should be demalions double-kingdom. So anyone that wants the five kingdoms in balanced size (which doesnt mean ressources) might want a closer look on this map (though it might be hard to vote higher than demalion).

O again has minimum possible bordercount (if 1&2 is doublekingdom) but the coastline looks quite ragged. There are several spits of land around the continent.

P nearly has minimum possible borders, too and no thin middle. It has five biomes without coast, which is by far the highest number (second is 3), so if you dont like the sea, this is your map.

R has the thinnest big bay of all maps. Its so thin, it could nearly count as a big internal lake and it should be possible to build a bridge over the thin part. Its coastline is again quite ragged. Every kingdom has 2-3 borders.

S has a very thin middle, giving it two big gulfs at both eastern and western sides. In addition to that, it has a thin bay, which might provide protection from the see for a fleet and allow easier travel at the southern coast. Biome sizes are quite balanced here. Every kingdom borders 2-3 other kingdoms.

From a map voting game point of view, 5 maps are not on any server's list E,F,O,P,Q to bring one of those on Selene's 2nd round you'd need to get it above map M.

we can also see that apart from maps B and C other Selene's map are quite low, so any map that is not 1st or second on an other server (I,H,N,A) and maybe T which is too far above in votes on NA-E, are available if they can get past map G vote count we are talking about K,D,R,S

Of all maps available to potentially enter Selene's round 2 i like R and K the most, F is an absolute no go for me and i do not like E,S,Q and D, P is P and seems like a bad choice but who knows what it will actually look like in round 2 and o seems interesting with all the horns and strange land formations.

So if i had to order them i'd go R,K,O,P,Q,S,D,E,F

If your most sought after feature is a border between Kypiq and Hrothi, map R offers that, it also provides an interesting sea feature between K4 and K5.

I can bring K in Selene's round 2 alone (with numbers we see now) but i can not flip R by my own, i am open to discussion if you feel so inclined.

Not that I have any say here. But wouldn't others be open to map C in the second round? We have no idea what other details are coming, that map could turn out to be awesome. Or are people so petty there, they won't even vote on a good map. Just cause of some drama?

Something to note, that isn't an island up north on E. Caspian did comment on discord, that land is still connected to the mainland.

Posted By Gunnlang at 05:44 AM - Mon Oct 29 2018

Not that I have any say here. But wouldn't others be open to map C in the second round? We have no idea what other details are coming, that map could turn out to be awesome. Or are people so petty there, they won't even vote on a good map. Just cause of some drama?

Something to note, that isn't an island up north on E. Caspian did comment on discord, that land is still connected to the mainland.

You totally right …. for drama and to screw Arkadia ,4 kingdom will vote a map against Us . Not considering the fact the Map C is a better choice of map for many factors. The other for Kingdom are only drive by hate vs Arkadia. We can play with any map but the random player can they? The random player are stuck in the middle..... so my message go to those random player..... If you think that Map C is better then Map B, make your vote count in Round 2 , VOTE MAP C, use your brain not your hate....

As unpleasing it might be for the people trying to measure epeen on Selene right now, round one is about political borders.

The real lay of the land will be known in round 2 and in round 2 maps that looked promising in round 1 may change flavor completely and the other way around.

The goal of round 1 is to gather 5 maps with acceptable political display to allow enough choices in round 2. Focusing only on two maps is narrowing our options in round 2 and proof of unfitting leadership skill and vision; we should all remind our Selene leaders of the old saying " you should not put all your eggs in the same basket".

Posted By Augustus_Aquila at 10:21 AM - Mon Oct 29 2018

... for drama and to screw Arkadia ,4 kingdom will vote a map against Us ... The other for Kingdom are only drive by hate vs Arkadia.

Well, well, my Lord Augustus_Aquila,

We are aware the To'resk like their meals served with some extra salt, but statements like those would not befit a To'resks diplomatic nature. So I take it you are either not a To'resk or your observations and deductions are bamboozled with concerns. I dare state your reading of the situation stems from a different truth than the one many others perceive of the matter.

Cheerio, Alte

So quick run down of why B is currently leading in Selene.

B and C were pretty much always going to be the maps on which the majority agreed given that only one kingdom had objections to either so even odds that if Arkadia had stayed in the negotiations we were going to end up in this situation anyway, possibly with one or two more maps thrown in as exchange for the two kingdoms who had objections to B and C (maybe T and Q).

However when Arkadia left the negotiations to do their own thing the remaining kingdoms rather quickly agreed on B. Most of the debate in the last few days has been about backups and backups to backups.

We couldn't find any backups to our backups that were acceptable to all and not already at extremely high IP on the Luna or Angelica servers so we went for getting B and seeing which is better topography wise come R2.

There isn't some grand plan to screw over Arkadia (though I will admit there probably is some epeen pride in getting B higher than C) in fact everyone in the negotiations channel is in favour of getting them back in the channel for R2 assuming they can actually negotiate rather than demand.

As Markof has said R1 is about political borders and more people liked the political borders of B than any other map.

On a side note I'd love to have R in the running @Markof, certainly much more than K (#trashmap) give me an estimate of how much IP we'd need, cause if it's over one milion I doubt we're gonna flip it from Luna.

I like how at least To'resk brethren are together on map B. I see a bright future on trades with my To'resk friends to the north. Actually I'm kinda envious on their marsh lands, but we can always trade. Every difference makes room for negotiations. And if trade is not working, which is strange among To'resk communities, there is always free beer and shnaps :)

Brothers should not fight.

@Ilyria: I think, you wrote one 'not' more than intended.

So... till now, interest on map R was shown... lets look if more people raise their voices for something... otherwise, I'll try getting R up as 3-5

Posted By Gromschlog at 5:31 PM - Mon Oct 29 2018

@Ilyria: I think, you wrote one 'not' more than intended.

Oh my, how did that get there? I think someone trolled me :P

Map P is the only way to go. Vote P to be free!

It looks like Map B will be the continent for Selene in round 2.

Map G has the same issue as map C. There is a good reason NA-E and NA-W did not bother at all with those maps. It only has 5 borders, the minimum possible.

Compare this to the current top ranked maps:

Map N (NA-E #1) - 8 borders

Map I (NA-W #1) - 7 borders

Map B (EU #1) - 8 borders

Map J fits pretty well and is well within range to get into the map pool for round 2. It has 8 borders so it will probably be considered by the big shots. Worth campaigning for in my opinion.

Why would i want more borders ?

Just in case people forgot to read things : "With the knowledge of where trees, food, and water are, as well as the boundaries of the mountains, watersheds, rivers, etc. we can identify what the boundaries of the different domains will be. Kingdoms are generally divided by large topographic structures, such as mountains, large rivers, or biome changes. " from a world being built

Borders in Elyria are not only some lines on a map, they are natural limits, the more borders the less easy it is to travel.

It is time that people realize that if we can not see the topographic details in round one, we have the right to not be stupid and make some research and try to get an idea of what is behind the names of the biomes.

mountainous biomes, steppe, deserts, swamps all those biomes are going to be hard to travel into, land trade, travel and communication are going to be difficult and require lots of infrastructures and development. That's part of the reason why toresk master and defend waterways.

You want a map to trade, search a map with lots of coasts and lots of little creeks and strange shore feature to host lots of ports, but be realist and forget all you silly dreams of land based trade routs.